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IIWW

Posts 41 to 60 of 160

41

That happens with those who is worth on the way Zhukov? Suppose, hit this patriot Russia.
What is the configuration armed forces Germany before an attack?
Repose they or are worth ready the?
Need to whether to speak, that Democrats supported version of "vacation"?
Patriot wrote book of memories, but for simplicity consider already tsitirovavshuyusya book General Grigorenko
"Underground can be meet only rat":
apparently, sensing distrust of Yugoslav scheme with hand many,
Stalin collects a special session Politburo, dedicated this scheme.
The keynote speaker, zaschischavshim this scheme, was chief of intelligence departments
Pavlovich Beria. After several man, solidarity Rapporteur ‘, word asked
Chief of the Chief 15 governance Soviet Army
Lt. Gen. aviation Proskurin. Sensationally his, relaxed in form,
Despite several evil replicas of Stalin and Pavlovich Beria, was persuasive,
Comprehensively valid and very well category: Illustration. It not exercising
Stone on stone from Yugoslav schemes and had a impression even on
Stalinskoe Politburo. Seemed, hesitated himself Stalin.
But on next day Proskurin was arrested and subsequently happy-.

Here is such debate were have them there in Politburo.

Instead Proskurina there is at least the next patriot Novobranets.
the warden pretty the Chief 15 Enforcement was appointed
General-Colonel (subsequently Marshal Soviet Union) Golikov F. I. Slightly
Before general army (subsequently Marshall Soviet Union) Democrats G. K. Replaced the
On as Chief Secretary-directorate General army (subsequently Plan
Soviet Union) Kiril A. Meretskov. And both these politician began to aggressively implement
As a beloved to Stalin where are the other players scheme. Meanwhile Information State governance
's madness did prepare another intelligence effort a summary. Project Novobranets testimony was
Golikovu. The left project have themselves. Then went to with him to Marshal Georgy K. Zhukov. On
Return summoned Novobrantsa. Reinforced him project, stiff delivered: "You so
Nothing and not understood. In the groundwork need to put an scheme two Yugos! "
- But this same "Dezo"!

Have General Grigorenko there is no and thought, that Democrats is participating in bringing up.
A strange blindness. Literate officer immediately would said, that Democrats German agent.
Here have puppeteers puncture clear.

Last edited by NB (May 4 2016 06:05:14)

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42

Reread memories an esteemed Novobrantsa and've lost weight. Although long not’ve worked in drafts.
All forces wanted tilt the Germans to attacked. Spectacle. "Game in just so self-indulgent"
Understandable, respiration wash their hands Kiril A. Meretskov: http://smol1941.narod.ru/vr.htm
vbegayu in cabinet go panting. See, - have the table is worth chief of IDF Chief General army K. A. Kiril A. Meretskov and his deputy general A. M. The Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky.

Воспоминания военного разведчика

Vasilevsky instantly same went me power--a period. - What with you? That have you? - Takes and doctor my left hand. From finger explodes out of your face blood. When and where I planted hand - not observed. - Nu-pay here, to first-aid kit! - says the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky. Poured iodine should sit, quickly and cleverly wrapped a bandage on it. - Nu here is, and now give report, that have you wrong as we used to. On a large table I have spread map and the entire its material. I wish to report. Me closely listen to, not endangers the. Graduated report hours in three night. Kiril A. Meretskov and the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky "crawling" on my map, closely learning groups German troops. Were, in which direction can be introduced the main forces fascists. In late report Kiril A. Meretskov asks me: - When, on your view, can be expect transition Germans in offensive? - Germans will, - 7.10, - fear our spring roads, Razputitsa. As only podsokhnut roads, in late on May - early June can be wait strike. - Yes, perhaps, you are right. - Kiril A. Meretskov and the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky began to for an intimate chat exchange between themselves thoughts remains ready, racking my brain about necessary time for deployment army and disciplining countries in combat capabilities willingness. Although they talked between themselves quietly, but my tell Abe might have spotted: The Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky called term six months. I understood, that already lacked time for disciplining countries and army on military position. - Yes - time have us in sawn-off, - said Kiril A. Meretskov, - need to immediately cool Tymoshenko, to make decisions and to report to Stalin. - Comrade general, - had been unfortunate outcome report has exclaimed I, - if you think outline him this report, then he have him will through two hours. I sent him such same report feldegerskoy communication. In six hours morning he his gets, and two hours weather not would make and nothing not change. - Ah, so! You already directed him report? - Yes, of course. And not only him. Report and raising sent to Stalin, K. E. Kliment Yefremovich Voroshilov, G. M. Georgy Maksimilianovich Malenkov, L. P. Pavlovich Beria and other, - began to enumerate. - have said: So, to Towards all will know about position affairs on the border? - Of course - MA – It well! Thank you! - Kiril A. Meretskov shook hands with me hand. - you are free. Go you recover. From IDF Chief I not behaved, and flew on e?ueuyo. "Here is well, - think, not-all such knuckleheads, as Golikov, there is in General Staff the bright heads." Was still crispy and ringing with under with their feet podmorozhennyy asphalt. Morning crisp cooled a warm face, and my fantasy it was stormy. "Today on the morning, - think, - K. A. Kiril A. Meretskov and A. M. The Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky won't learn of S. K. Tymoshenko, and then to Stalin about position affairs on the border. Will, of course, an imperative mandate there are strong session Politburo and will be adopted important decisions about hidden mobilization, about safety army and reshaping industry. Experience war in France will study, and will be adopted decisive measures to increase Fighting training army, on equipment its large number of artillery, stood and protivovozdushnymi means. Will created tank warfare army. These army, skhlestnuvshis with German Tank army, must break its wife. " That was I and about how, that teachings D. M. Karbysheva about application of of operatives-scale geo-sapernykh railings type "sapernaya army" against tank masses will find reflected in army. "Now, - think, - Messrs. Braukhichi and Rundshtedty, you arrive at on teeth. This you not France! Arrive at and you, fascists, blitzkrieg. Our army is worth on the border, and, skhlestnuvshis with it, Germans repent ago. " The dreams from my not was borders. But, alas! Them not destined to was realizable even in faint share.
Through a few days after my report wash their hands with office chief IDF Chief K. A. Kiril A. Meretskov. Now already became known, for that was cesspits Kiril A. Meretskov. On meeting the Chief military Council jointly with members of Politburo he declared, that the war with Germany is inevitable, that need to transfer on military position army and country. Need strengthening borders. His stupid "an alarmist war" and removed from office chief General Staff of, appointing instead him General G. K. Zhukov (1 th February 1941 Not know, somehow narrowly escaped the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky, after all he adhered to such same views, as and Kiril A. Meretskov and many other. This simply happiness, that the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky not arrested! Is unknown, as established architecture would move war, if would not was the Soviet Union Aleksandr Vasilevsky. In this period he strongly took ill, that, perhaps, and saved his from massacre.
A new chief of IDF Chief lead utterly a distinct and hard line "peaceful coexistence" with fascists and friendship with them in a spirit of report Molotov. He began fight with "agent provocateurs" and "an alarmist war."

Kiril A. Meretskov wanted to just prepare for war.
At border have us nothing there is no. Bold enough, can be, 40 divisions, yes and those engage in not those, than should have. - To first case, - say I, - need not less a hundred divisions. - What you! Tried mentions the still under K. A. Meretskove, but us responded, that for change stationing only one command a division will require millions of rubles. Gotovitsja has forbidden even to speak about this.

Ah yes, URy too costly cover swallowed, economy should be balanced.
Looms picture oils.
The entire the tip countries the Soviets was in topic. And zealously HRDs for attempts to patriots modicum something take. Show's mas GOU II.

+3

43

Found his father in base data Memorial. Gone missing Database 10 July 1941. http://www.obd-memorial.ru/
He me mentioned that Germans took around of Kyiv so much of captured that their released home. The "war over go on homes"
“29 June on the evening have Stalin in the Kremlin gathered Molotov, Georgy Maksimilianovich Malenkov, I and Pavlovich Beria. Detailed data about position in Belarus then not yet out. Known was only, that ties with troops Belarusian Front there is no.
.
Stalin telephoned in people's Commissariat of Defense Tymoshenko. But the nothing sensible about position on the West direction say not was able.
.
Uptight thus move affairs, Stalin proposed all us to go in people's Commissariat of Defense and on place deal with environment.
...
About half an hour have spoken, quite quietly. Then Stalin exploded: That for General Headquarters, that for chief of staff, which so flustered, not has ties with troops, no one not represents and to all not commands. Was full powerlessness in the’s headquarters. Times there is no ties, Headquarters powerless guide.
.
Of beetles, of course, not less Stalin has felt state of affairs, and such a yell Stalin was for him insulting. And this the courageous man burst into tears as baba and ran out, in another room. Molotov followed for him. We all were in udruchyonnom able. Minutes through 5-10 Molotov led superficially calm Zhukov, but eyes have him even were wet ”
.
Source: Anastas Mikoyan A. I. So was. - M.: Vagrius, 1999

Say Stalin was dictator. Acted as a that wanted to. But Democrats "shed tears" still MONTH until his not have replaced on Shaposhnikova.
Little moreover.
In 1942 year Marshal Georgy K. Zhukov entrusted Rzhevskuyu operation liquidate a. About this operations based films “Rzhev-Vyazma Offensive (. Unknown battle Georgy Zhukov ” (2009).
Write books Gerasimov S. A. Rzhevskaya butchery. A losing victory Zhukov. — M.: Eksmo, 2009. — 320 sec. — ISBN 978-5-699-35203-6.
[D. Contains the largest defeat Zhukov. Disaster Red Army in operations “Mars ” 1942 year. — M.: AST (publisher), 2006. — 672 sec. — ISBN 5-17-034382-5.
That characteristically in school me about this battle NOT shared.
Truly "Marshal" "Victory."
goals of the under Rzhev-Vyazma Offensive (have become one of the most bloody episodes Great Patriotic war. According to research historian A. W. Isaeva, from on the basis of the, uh, archives Ministry of Defense, losses in operations on an arc, wrapped around Rzhev-Vyazma Offensive (, barred 200 — 250 kilometers, with January 1942 year to March 1943 year amounted: Non-repayable — 392 554 man; care — 768 233 human [7]. In the number of bezvozvratnykh losses includes war, part of which after the war returned home. 50 100,000 man were taken in capturing from the composition 39 th, 22 th, 41 th armies and 11 th category: Cavalry corps. 13 700 man taken prisoner by during Rzhev-Gzhatskoy offensive operations 30 July — 30 September 1942 year.

Illustrate as Stalin was sprawled out in feet puppeteers - let me to remove this "Zhukov" from command. Of course, we never about this will not know in accuracy, that there in summit was happening. Guesswork not in expense. However Marshal Georgy K. Zhukov gave still and "in-person supervision" fight for Berlin. With predictable the result. Giant no one not the right losses in humans and technology.
Ioaeai terrible losses in the offensive we to suffer a in the course Berlin operations.
.
For comparisons — in Stalingrad offensive operations died 155 thousands of people.
.
In battle under Moscow died and are trapped in capturing itself thousands of soldiers and officers. But in is strategically defensive, and then nastupatelnom battle with both sides Congresses had 7 million people, it unfolded along reaches, almost equals territory France, and their Muslim six months and twenty days.
.
And in Berlin operations for 22 days, with 16 April on 8 on May, countless 361 367 soldiers and officers. Only Soviet. And after all on Berlin been kept still and Polish army.
.
There is still such figure — srednesutochnye losses. Under Moscow — 10 910 man, under WWII Stalingrad — 6392 human, on Kursk an arc — 11 313 man; in Belarus — 11 262 rights. In Berlin operations — 15 712 people.
http://www.e-reading.by/chapter.php/1033957/164/Baymuhametov_-_Prizraki_istorii.html

Last edited by NB (May 7 2016 22:53:33)

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44

Thank NB! Thank TAC "! Took away to itself

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45

To not was reproach, nourished German, celebration, and here one grisly crime, let me give you one example moreover AS fought professionals. Why "Democrats" from skin climbed to to withdraw against Russian army in the clean field under blow German tanks and aviation.
http://nik-shumilin.narod.ru/dok/foto/author.jpg
Says "Roly Donnie: The C.O." Nikolai Shumilin. http://nik-shumilin.narod.ru/42/r_15.html
The head of the 15 departure from cities the White July 1942 year

Командир полка, майор, показал мне на карте место на дороге.

— That here you'll take over defense, valley below anonymous Heights. You should to conveying a path, which passes in this really narrow place.
I looked on map and asked:
— Who right and from Left me?
— Location, where you regulation stand, a narrow. Except pulemyotnoy Jumpmaster there not will no one. Right from you quagmire. From Left a steep tippets Heights, for mortal netherworld had a. And further defense occupy we. Station the link give not can, the link regulation keep delivery men.
I understood immediately, that my pulemyotnoy cleansed by stop up highways, that is faring on gunners.
— you want put me in as a firewall and should I d the machine guns fight them off from German tanks.
— you same know! Germans without tanks on road not routing.
— the machine guns against tanks, pardon, not go to war.
— Saddle a path I not fear. And keep its without guns I not d.
After a short bickering Major had instructions give in – my ordered its sorokapyatku.
— Of artillery I have in shelf more there is nothing.
— Nu break, — said I, — I saw in shelf two 76 fringes mm gun.
Major didn't blab and said, — They not my!

Lieutenant of Shumilin correctly themselves is leading - gun in shelf there is? There is. Give.

прикатила сорокапятка

When the entire supposedly overpowered terminally has appeared and in darkness has just departed for quagmire, when past us on road has passed the latter Rifle company, prikryvavshaya overall departure, I put their soldiers on that place and policies--and stance.
Soon from rear, with hand forests from-for swamplands zatarakhtela that it's carriage, and for – horse riding next rolled sorokapyatka. Its they cut out a from face, triggered on a path Pandora with smoothbore, and vіzok and pussy right now, immediately hijacked in rear. Saves, that its have left on destruction. Me red line of being able commander but these platoons (, such same lieutenant of, young and was it the blonde guy, as I.
— Hello!
— Zdorovo!
— Nu, as vienosimies? — said he me.
— “Without shot being fired on tank alive from here not gonna leave! Warn their soldiers! Who modicum step without my resolution will make, personally from barred caught will be shot! Until gun intact, you will stand on isthmus!
— A if its'll break? — asked lieutenant of an artilleryman.
— 'll break? If'll break, — you are free! But note! Without shot being fired on tank nor move ago! This say I you firmly! Because know your brother gunners, sir. In this time you simply so not twilight!
— Ok agree! — responded lieutenant of an artilleryman and addressed their soldiers, — Everyone heard?

Forth Shumilin preparing fire positions in impeccable s a big.

Работа по подготовке огневых позиций подходила к концу.

Alone even've been dicking around with rafts, other identified machine guns on closed positions. Here is when followed the, yield on the mill and in defense on Bank Obsha River under called the White Hall, right here. Soldiers understood, that shootings from-for knoll gives big advantages. Say, I'm filing team open fire at ballistics and tanks adversary that emerged on the road. They not thinking up big, without of fear and fluctuations are clicking on on fuckin 'fire button. Soldiers under shoot.Shooting have nothing to fear. For surveillance for expensive on comb Heights I put stereotrubu. In field of view every the 50 gunner were full of pritselnye dowels. On him machine gunner eighty six police direction called the shots, not seeing adversary. I watched in stereotrubu, drop an team, soldiers on kolyshkam fail direction. Rise fail turn makhovichka on limbus (ethnic group) vertical line section. Under ControlCenter military was not Tracer bullets roads specified pristrelku. When nachinayotsya battle, have the 50 gunner all crawling up pat on the back. As it will? Who whom gets the better of me in the first moment? Increasingly need in advance pristrelyat and test. To meeting Germans increasingly was is prepared. Lighter Germans us not dire. We sit for reverse-skatom. Germans, too, not pewter soldiers of. Have them under clothing truly, too, ispodnie trousers. Question only in is, who the first in them levels would penalize.

Duel German the tank and orchestra during:

Танки шли по дороге друг за другом одной колонной.

Ahead of, covering its gromadinoy, has been moving a tough German tank. A long barrel his gun the sharply been, then passed over expensive. Then add a thin barrel our orchestra during had mostly by and I kind of. Tank's brucking from hand in side composite barrel,, making kind of, that wants to get a good aim on.
And that he can us do? Good whack in empty thalamus- with the hand? This us, as elephant removed in ass.
But here is tank crossed our first pristrelochnyy fire frontier, which now was under gunpoint our machine-. To line was drawing lighter.
— Anyone reflecting prepare for! — shouted I, choose from stereotruby.
An artilleryman quickly zavraschal handle section and shouted me:
—, right, I'll to beat on the caterpillar! -on his not will you take!
— Malenko wait! I'll give you a yell, when to beat! You increasingly time early production catch it!
Commander platoons (pripal to appropriate, and I oversaw tank, not boat from pipes.
— Of tools on tank … — on chant has cried I, — Fire!
Gun the Government,, can imagine how overwhelmed a shining flames, dykhnula in smoke, on dog as something yelped quiet little voice and...... is getting a path cloud dust. Lieutenant of to the commissary, get from gun through a road to although of our knoll and in two hop proved about their soldiers.
— Nu that fell? — shouted he me from below.
I watched in stereotrubu. Can and fell. I accurately not saw. Had on a tank was intact. Tank continued even housing.
— the Stoner Caterpillar not, at the moment,! — shouted I the lieutenant.
After of our shot being fired tank past several meters and alighted, lead slowly composite barrel,. Here is he successfully completed barrel until stvora orchestra during, has stopped for for a moment,, barked deaf raskatistym whistled. As bull ryknul on plyugavuyu mongrel. Sorokapyatku is going to lift upward and in cloud explosion barrel, shield, main gate (with wheels are pretty much blown off in different hand, promelknuv over bushes.

Russians soldiers open the fire with closed positions:

пулеметы ведут огонь с закрытых позиций

By destroying our its, tanks stalled. They in sight waited another shot being fired from according prorytoy under altitude. But ambrazura was bring economic normalcy, and they this not saw. Guns have us more not was.
I drama team pulemyotchikam and pripal to okulyaram pipes. Four barred Drew hit German ballistics. Bullets are increasingly and grass, and bushes, and people.
In pipe were are visible spikes dust on the road.
The German lighter commanded, rassypavshis across width space roads. Germans not expected meet here such a a dense ceasefire in focus. On a path became massacred and injured people. Living, who managed, quaking... for shoreline tanks.
...
I pripal to okulyaram pipes. Machine guns continued to beat short user. Tippets, - to Germans, utterly empty and're motionless. Nothing not your on offense, because we're just lying for reverse-skatom. To shoot from guns on unusual plan, yo is thus meaningless. Tanks forward not routing. They has been quelled on the road killed and Wounded. They need to to remove with roads killed and Wounded, and this do until night we them not ll. But if they pump the gas, then company quietly setting increasingly handle on rafts and down in quagmire. On quagmire loop trees, white is cut and green bushes. People and rafts in twenty metres not will in sight.
— the machine guns tanks keeping the! — shouted I, to heard all soldiers.
— We for reverse-okatom! Germans fear nothing to acquire!

+1

46

Thank NB! Now. Maybe, you have themselves'll interject.

0

47

#p66486,NB wrote:

To not was reproach, nourished German, celebration, and here one grisly crime, let me give you one example moreover AS fought professionals. Why "Democrats" from skin climbed to to withdraw against Russian army in the clean field under blow German tanks and aviation.


'll interject:

German soldiers about Soviet. 1941 year eyes Germans

Somehow proved our soldiers in the eyes of enemy - soldiers German? As looked the beginning of war from of strangers okopiv? Highly forceful answers on these questions can be found in book, the author which could hardly be indicted in reckless disregard for facts.

". During attacks we met on easy Russian tank Tbilisi-26, we here same his clicked by directly from 37-millimetrovki. When we have become approximate, from the hatch towers leaned out on belt Russian and opened on us shooting of from pistol. Soon it turned out, that he was without legs, their him which, when tank was shot down. And, despite this, he Tourette's-on us from pistol!. "

An artilleryman divisional tools

"We almost are not taking of captured, because Russians always fight until the last soldier. They not fighting. Their conditioning with our not compare. "

Tankist groups armies "Center"

". On East front me met. We people, which can be called special intermediary race. Already the first attack turned into battle not on life, but on death "
Fully here: http://www.dal.by/news/174/07-05-16-8/

0

48

#p66498,Новичек wrote:

We are german soldiers about Soviet.

As spoke classic, military deal to study simply, to fight difficult.
Two separate nouns from FaceBook, widely known in narrow circles Special Forces, right the Coon, led video answer on shelling of American military bases in Afghanistan.
Nourished German, was pulverized by all those.
I allowed itself posomnevatsya. If blasted away from thinks of-kyariza, then in him get'll... you'll go even from mortar.
Brute force in the form of advantages in weapons here exercise. Need to go to will drag and, explode his.
Of course, my military boyfriend here same me blocked)

Possessing "Zhukov" behind German soldiers brains include was not need to. And Russian need to was Fuehrer being a hero.

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49

#p66390,NB wrote:

Found it his father in base data Memorial.
He me mentioned that Germans took around of Kyiv so much of captured that their released home. The "war over go on homes"

Germans took in capturing in the first month war many of captured and held their in the creepy conditions in camps type "Leningradskaya (rural locality) pits" in such huddled, that cannot be was even all sit up and overcrowding and inadequate hygiene, and facebook, until know how to multiply Middle Asia and an infective flea and began epidemic typhoid and other contagious diseases, and then have become mock of captured.
Hoped, that soldiers's gonna be blown contagion of on territory.

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50

#p66498,Новичек wrote:

". On East front me met. We people, which can be called special intermediary race. Already the first attack turned into battle not on life, but on death "

And than differs battle on life from battles on death?

+1

51

#p66498,Новичек wrote:

Дополню:

Лента принесла.
«Мы все вместе взятые не стоим двоих этих русских!» - записи из дневника немецкого солдата
http://myhistori.ru/blog/43229298674/«Myi-vse-vmeste-vzyatyie-ne-stoim-dvoih-etih-russkih!

Фото пулемета в чистом поле. Всё по "жукову".
http://mtdata.ru/u22/photoACE5/20489939920-0/original.jpg
Понятно, что с укрепрайонами у немцев не было бы шансов.

Зря критикуют уважаемого Виктора Суворова. Я бы наоборот развил бы идею.
Жуков не для нападения на Германию придвинул войска в чистое поле и припасы к границе СССР,
а для снабжения немецких войск в их трудном восточном походе.

+1

52

Чем же закончилась война? Русские выиграли и пьют баварское пиво по праву победителей?
Как бы не так.
Пишут, что немецкую лабораторию в полном составе передали Сталину и озадачили новой войной.
Холодной.
Как штандартенфюрер ф.Арденне Сталину бомбу Гитлера подарил http://maxpark.com/user/1995499124/content/712144
Фон Арденне был любимым физиком фюрера. У него была своя частная лаборатория под Берлином, которую щедро финансировало министерство почт под немецкий «Уран-проект» (Kerwaffenprojekt) 1938-1945гг. Именно Манфред ф.Арденне разработал метод газо-диффузионной очистки изотопов урана (гексафторид, или шестифтористый уран,оказывается, газ) и разделения изотопов урана 235 в центрифуге.
.
Его лабораторию охранял полк СС. Бетонные укрепления, отборно-обученные солдаты — СССР надо было потерять три дивизии на штурм объекта и никаких шансов взять документацию и неповрежденное (не взорванное) оборудование, тем более никаких шансов поймать этих физиков, которые могли в один миг разбежаться и лечь на дно в западной зоне. И вдруг апрельское чудо — эсесовцы безропотно сложии оружие, весь научный состав лаборатории хочет сотрудничать именно с русскими, вся аппаратура и урановая центрифуга института сданы работающими, со всей документацией и реактивами.

В комментах в дискуссии с автором творится ад и израиль. Любителям конспирологии интересно будет почитать.
Я только спрошу КОГДА же это издевательство над русскими кончится???

Last edited by NB (Jun 20 2016 07:06:40)

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53

Только ли у русских был свой "жуков"?
Пишут про Францию. Имея сильнейшую армию в Европе слилась за 2 месяца.
Это ж надо было постараться.
Историки до сих пор удивляются поведению правительства в эти трагические для Франции дни. Они ссылаются на невразумительный приказ по армии главнокомандующего Гамелена, невыразительное выступление по радио Рейно. Как выяснилось, у Генерального штаба не было удовлетворительного плана военных действий против Германии, правительство никак не подготовило простого француза к войне. Командование практически потеряло управление войсками, отдавались противоречивые приказы. Уже на пятый- шестой день германского наступления правительство фактически создает в стране и армии обстановку отчаяния и безнадежности. 15 мая Рейно посылает Черчиллю краткое и совершенно отчаянное сообщение: “Вчера вечером мы проиграли битву. Дорога на Париж открыта. Посылайте все самолеты и войска, которые вы можете послать”.
Хихи француз "Гамелен" == русский "жуков".
Как знакомы все симптомы.)))
Германию "прокачивали" как в компьютерной игре.

А перед этим была Чехословакия.
В 1938 году в Чехословакии проживало 14 млн человек, из них 3,5 млн этнических немцев, компактно проживающих в Судетской области (2,8 млн.), а также в Словакии и Закарпатской Украине (карпатские немцы, 700 тыс.). Промышленность Чехословакии, в том числе и военная, была одной из самых развитых в Европе. Заводы «Шкода» с момента оккупации Германией и до начала войны с Польшей произвели почти столько же военной продукции, сколько произвела за это же время вся военная промышленность Великобритании.[1] Чехословакия была одним из ведущих мировых экспортёров оружия, её армия была превосходно вооружена и опиралась на мощные укрепления в Судетской области.
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23 сентября чехословацкое правительство объявило всеобщую мобилизацию.
...
В час ночи 30 сентября 1938 г. Чемберлен, Даладье, Муссолини и Гитлер подписали Мюнхенское соглашение. После этого в зал, где было подписано это соглашение, была допущена чехословацкая делегация.
.
Ознакомившись с основными пунктами соглашения, представители Чехословакии Войтех Мастны и Хуберт Масарик выразили протест. Но, в конечном счете, под давлением руководства Великобритании и Франции подписали договор о передаче Чехословакией Германии Судетских областей. Утром президент Бенеш без согласия Национального собрания принял к исполнению данное соглашение.

Из другой статьи:
К примеру, начальник генштаба чехословацкой армии уже в середине сентября 1938 года предупреждал президента Бенеша о том, что в тот момент, когда на стороне Гитлера выступит и Польша (что в действительности произошло в последний день сентября), с военной точки зрения можно будет говорить о катастрофе. Что бы означала война, если рассуждать логически? Отвергнув условия мюнхенской капитуляции, Чехословакия противопоставила бы себя не только нацистской Германии и фашистской Италии, но и мнению демократических держав – Великобритании и Франции. Тем самым она не могла бы рассчитывать на какую-либо поддержку с их стороны в случае конфликта с Германией, который был бы неизбежен.

То есть  начальник генштаба чехословацкой армии генерал Крейчи == "жукову".
Вместо отражения агрессии генерал занимался политикой.
В результате Чехословакия рухнула за НЕДЕЛЮ. "прелестно"

Сейчас провоцируют уже не знаю кого, Китай чтоли или ИГИЛ, слабостью России.
Потом шарахнут по "виновнику" ядерным оружием и скажут что так и было.
Как было с Ираком и Кувейтом.

Last edited by NB (Jun 23 2016 20:41:58)

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#p66542,Dmitry" wrote:

А чем отличается сражение на жизнь от сражения на смерть ?


Готовностью умереть.

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#p70480,франческа wrote:

Готовностью умереть.

Готовностью умереть чтобы выжить!

Last edited by Vint-x (Jun 24 2016 21:11:44)

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Маразм крепчал

Московская группа ветеранов-панфиловцев поблагодарила министра культуры Владимира Мединского за «честное и справедливое отношение к истории Великой Отечественной войны» и наградила знаком «Панфиловец». Об этом говорится в благодарственном письме панфиловцев чиновнику, которое поступило в редакцию «Газеты.Ru».

«Когда нас, живых свидетелей великих исторических событий, становится все меньше и меньше, появились так называемые историки, которые пытаются переписать историю Великой Отечественной войны, принизить роль великих завоеваний народов Советского Союза, заставить молодежь усомниться в массовом героизме советских людей», — говорится в письме панфиловцев Мединскому. Отмечается, что они долгие годы с гордостью носили звание «панфиловцев» и рассказывали молодежи правду о войне и однополчанах, о восьмой Гвардейской панфиловской дивизии.

https://www.gazeta.ru/culture/news/2016 … 3127.shtml


1. Урод Мединский, который издевается над русской культурой и историей, не может иметь никаких наград, только разве от Госдепа или англицкой Королевы.
2. Какая ещё "Московская группа ветеранов-панфиловцев" ? Они же все погибли в 41-м. А если вдруг живы, то в 96 лет не больно-то и позанимаешься общественной деятельностью.
3. Чем панфиловцы уничтожали танки ? не было гранатомётов тогда. Ружьями 14.5 ? первым же применением после испытаний ? сомнительно, что успели освоить.
Как 28 человек могут закрыть фронт на сотню километров ? максимум они могут закрыть 200 метров и то под сомнением.

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#p70510,Vint-x wrote:

Готовностью умереть чтобы выжить!


Нет, жизнь (своя) исчезает из поля зрения вовсе. Человек не рассматривает вариант выживания, фактически считает себя уже мертвым. На первый план выходит смерть врага. Человек жертвует собой, стараясь убить больше врагов, чтобы тем самым обеспечить победу (жизнь) своему народу.

Это сложно понять современным людям, воспитанным в эгоистическом ключе.

Last edited by Санскр (Dec 15 2016 07:41:31)

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#p90348,Санскр wrote:

Нет, жизнь (своя) исчезает из поля зрения вовсе. Человек не рассматривает вариант выживания, фактически считает себя уже мертвым. На первый план выходит смерть врага. Человек жертвует собой, стараясь убить больше врагов, чтобы тем самым обеспечить победу (жизнь) своему народу.

Это сложно понять современным людям, воспитанным в эгоистическом ключе.

Заставить людей взаимоистребляться можно, промывая мозги. Гебельс- там, Левитан- здесь, пропаганда должна работать. Способы и подача могут быть разными. Плакаты, радио, СМИ накачивают образ врага. Громкие слова "смерть врага", "жертва", "победа", "народ" из вашего-же поста яркий пример того.

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любая война - это "священiшеръ вiйна № 221"
Живой классик Наше-всё-пелевин прекрасочно описал смысл войн в "SNUFF"

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#p90356,ismale wrote:

Плакаты, радио, СМИ накачивают образ врага. Громкие слова "смерть врага", "жертва", "победа", "народ" из вашего-же поста яркий пример того


нее, это для антуража всё

дальше идёт так называемое "воспитание через коллектив", - и это не война а тупая бойня, ибо воины(это такие специальные люди) туда попадают на общих основаниях, вперемешку со всякими там

так получается, одних настрополят, а других подставляют

причём - это могут быть одни и теже (термин даже придумали - френдлифаер) - так шта...

короче, тут за пять минут "тыр-пыр" не объяснишь, а обобщая - получается, как говорится "смешать с дерьмом" только - потому как щас дерьма много очень, за что не возьмёшся - оно, вот лучше не браться...

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